11-24-2015, 04:20 AM
Well... first thing off, thank you to everyone who's joined into this conversation - it's amazing to see so many big personalities from the site, including even Proto and Greg/Omni, having a mature debate around here. It's been a very enjoyable read to me thus far!
I see both sides having a fair point, really - Freedom to write and developing your character, vs the Underverse being more than just an inconvenience that you'll get out of after just writing up a handful of big posts. I believe I may have looked at this comparison a bit too "black and white", though I do keep believing the arguments Arthuria and I put up in the original post - in that, in my opinion, the Underverse would need to have a change somewhere.
A few further ideas that I came up with (partially inspired by the other posts, I'll admit it) are listed in the spoiler below, in any case. I feel like they capture the "Evil"ness of the Underverse whilst still allowing for character development. They're just vague designs for now though.[spoiler]An alternate questline: Crafting an Antibanishment Circle. It would be a gray area for good characters, forced to do evil things in order to escape the Underverse. Crafting an AB-Circle or whatever we're going to call it would require components scattered across the Underverse, which are very hard to obtain - like say, a rare ore, an incantation held in a book only present in Diablo's palace and a strand of his hair, all forged together in the hellfires of some closely guarded forge. The quest would then involve searching these ingredients and serving other demons in various ways to have a hope at acquiring it - and of course, those demons might just not keep their end of the bargain anyway. It'd be something your character has to do reluctantly, disgusted at themselves and helplessly angry - but when they finally hold that AB-Circle in their hands, it will have been worth it. Subsequent attempts would be easier because your character already knows where to look.
Sleeper Agent for Diablo. This is based on the current "Diablo can get you out of the Underverse" idea. You might not agree to become his servant, but who's to say that you have to be? Diablo could have his subordinates implant some form of posthypnotic order into your mind, triggered through something, then send you off to the Omniverse once more. Perhaps he intends you to deliver a gruesome message to Aragorn, speaking through you, or he will have you attempt to defeat a powerful secondary to weaken the Omniverse in preparation of his return - maybe he'll even have you do it thinking it's your own idea, so you gather a handful of allies for better chances!
Do you want fodder for a site-wide event? How about rather than doing minor tasks, Diablo is gathering a group of Sleeper Agents, to open the Black Gate from the outside? Nobody would expect that, given that people could just lie about how they escaped the Underverse, and take up residence in Camelot for any excuse.
Help from outside. This inspired by the Dwarf Fortress demons for anyone who happens to know the game, but there is a mechanic where demons stuck in Hell are summoned to the surface world by a deity which inscribes their true name on a stone slab. That slab can then be used, if the adventurer finds it, to banish the demon back to Hell.
There could be a similar consumable - the banished character must purchase it, put it into the Omniverse remotely, and someone else must summon them from the Underverse using that consumable. However, if someone is able to obtain the item, they can instantly banish the character brought back from the Underverse, right back down there.
Diablo sending people back for other reasons. This is more of a recollection of what other people mentioned - like Adam's nd Minato's proposition that Diablo would send back people simply as a show of power, to startle the Omniversians as in "I can do this, be afraid of me."[/spoiler]
This might also be making the Underverse a bit too harmless, but how about making it a bit more prison-like? A character sent down there will be stuck for a period of OOC time - say, some three months, which is a lot - before the next time they die they will respawn at the Nexus like usual. In addition, a minimum number of words would be required to be written in the Underverse so your character actually suffers a bit.
EDIT: To the above point I should say that that period of time should be in addition to the option of going through Diablo, not a replacement. Some people may want to get out early or be content with going through Diablo through any means.
I see both sides having a fair point, really - Freedom to write and developing your character, vs the Underverse being more than just an inconvenience that you'll get out of after just writing up a handful of big posts. I believe I may have looked at this comparison a bit too "black and white", though I do keep believing the arguments Arthuria and I put up in the original post - in that, in my opinion, the Underverse would need to have a change somewhere.
A few further ideas that I came up with (partially inspired by the other posts, I'll admit it) are listed in the spoiler below, in any case. I feel like they capture the "Evil"ness of the Underverse whilst still allowing for character development. They're just vague designs for now though.[spoiler]An alternate questline: Crafting an Antibanishment Circle. It would be a gray area for good characters, forced to do evil things in order to escape the Underverse. Crafting an AB-Circle or whatever we're going to call it would require components scattered across the Underverse, which are very hard to obtain - like say, a rare ore, an incantation held in a book only present in Diablo's palace and a strand of his hair, all forged together in the hellfires of some closely guarded forge. The quest would then involve searching these ingredients and serving other demons in various ways to have a hope at acquiring it - and of course, those demons might just not keep their end of the bargain anyway. It'd be something your character has to do reluctantly, disgusted at themselves and helplessly angry - but when they finally hold that AB-Circle in their hands, it will have been worth it. Subsequent attempts would be easier because your character already knows where to look.
Sleeper Agent for Diablo. This is based on the current "Diablo can get you out of the Underverse" idea. You might not agree to become his servant, but who's to say that you have to be? Diablo could have his subordinates implant some form of posthypnotic order into your mind, triggered through something, then send you off to the Omniverse once more. Perhaps he intends you to deliver a gruesome message to Aragorn, speaking through you, or he will have you attempt to defeat a powerful secondary to weaken the Omniverse in preparation of his return - maybe he'll even have you do it thinking it's your own idea, so you gather a handful of allies for better chances!
Do you want fodder for a site-wide event? How about rather than doing minor tasks, Diablo is gathering a group of Sleeper Agents, to open the Black Gate from the outside? Nobody would expect that, given that people could just lie about how they escaped the Underverse, and take up residence in Camelot for any excuse.
Help from outside. This inspired by the Dwarf Fortress demons for anyone who happens to know the game, but there is a mechanic where demons stuck in Hell are summoned to the surface world by a deity which inscribes their true name on a stone slab. That slab can then be used, if the adventurer finds it, to banish the demon back to Hell.
There could be a similar consumable - the banished character must purchase it, put it into the Omniverse remotely, and someone else must summon them from the Underverse using that consumable. However, if someone is able to obtain the item, they can instantly banish the character brought back from the Underverse, right back down there.
Diablo sending people back for other reasons. This is more of a recollection of what other people mentioned - like Adam's nd Minato's proposition that Diablo would send back people simply as a show of power, to startle the Omniversians as in "I can do this, be afraid of me."[/spoiler]
This might also be making the Underverse a bit too harmless, but how about making it a bit more prison-like? A character sent down there will be stuck for a period of OOC time - say, some three months, which is a lot - before the next time they die they will respawn at the Nexus like usual. In addition, a minimum number of words would be required to be written in the Underverse so your character actually suffers a bit.
EDIT: To the above point I should say that that period of time should be in addition to the option of going through Diablo, not a replacement. Some people may want to get out early or be content with going through Diablo through any means.
"(Note to self: insert quote & picture once I find stuff)"
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