Being TOO Honest?

[Jade Harley]

Do you think it's possible to be too honest?

Like, as a small and squishy human child I used to lie all the time. And then I got in trouble for it in a way that left a HUGE impression on my mind, and I haven't lied since. I feel physically ill whenever I encounter someone who's been lying to me or others, and I just can't bring myself to lie, even to keep another person happy.

It's gotten me into a lot of trouble with people like my mother, who is like, a chronic liar. For example, my grandparents sent her some eggs and she threw them out. When my grandparents asked about the eggs and if we'd used them, I said that she'd thrown them out, because like.... They asked. And then my mother told my grandparents that I must have been mistaken, because she "only threw out the eggshells", and then lectured me about it and how I probably hurt my grandparents' feelings. I feel like I was definitely in the wrong in this situation, but like.... I just can't lie. It would bother me for weeks if I did, no matter how harmless it was.

I dunno. I guess I'm just wondering how you guys feel about lying, because being truthful all the time is kinda painful and seems to do more harm than good. Is there a way to tactfully lie, and is it still morally okay to do that?

[Handsome Jack]

I prefer honesty in my life as well. That said, I understand the importance of the "white lie". Things like sparing the feelings of others (ever get a Christmas present you hated?), maintaining the innocent wonder of children (Santa, Easter Bunny), and just generally ensuring the social contract is maintained.

[Takanomiya Hijiri]

Do you think it's possible to be too honest?

Yup. No doubt about it. If someone asks you how they look and your entirely truthful answer is 'hideous', then that's a textbook example of being too honest. :xd:

Is there a way to tactfully lie,

Of course. Tactfully lying is substantially easier than tactfully telling the truth. In the aforementioned scenario, the tactful lie would be something like 'you look great'... the tactful truth would be to awkwardly avoid answering the question so as to not end up insulting someone to their face.

and is it still morally okay to do that?

That depends on whether you ascribe to a utilitarian or deontological form of ethics. A utilitarian would say that an action which causes the greatest amount of happiness for the greatest number of people is the correct one, even if it means breaking rules in order to take. A deontologist would say that rules are all-important and must be followed at all costs, even if that resulted in severe negative repercussions and left everyone unhappy.

Or, if that's too much effort, you could just go for the narcissism school of ethics: everything I do is automatically correct, because I'm the one doing it.
That one is my favourite.

P.S. You should watch 'The Invention of Lying'.

[Alex]

Everything Jeff said I agree with.

Other than that, there's no need to lie. Get your id under control.

[Jade Harley]

I prefer honesty in my life as well. That said, I understand the importance of the "white lie". Things like sparing the feelings of others (ever get a Christmas present you hated?), maintaining the innocent wonder of children (Santa, Easter Bunny), and just generally ensuring the social contract is maintained.

Oh yeah, I guess I've lied about these things without feeling too bad( I still feel guilty about not being as grateful as I could be for certain gifts.) Though... I've never really come into a situation where a kid asked if Santa was real and I had to say yes or crush their dreams. Lol.

The thing about people asking how they look... Idk, I've told people they look fine, because a lot of people do look pretty dang fine to me. Not sure if that's a white lie 'cause people don't usually ask.

[Omni]

The eggs thing, I'd have either lied or brushed over it (ie feigned ignorance). I'm a person who heavily values honesty, and finds most people disgustingly comfortable with lying, but over the years I've learned the high value of tact and when to save others' feelings. When it's related to subjective opinions especially (attractiveness, is this thing I made good or bad, am I stupid, and so on). Sometimes truth can be helpful, but oftentimes it's really unhelpful. Very few people have the confidence and self-worth to take unabashed, blunt criticism of themselves or things they've put their heart into and turn that into a positive.

It also depends on a person's state of mind. If a person asks "Does this look good?" of an outfit, from a purely "Hmm ..." emotional standpoint, you might say, yeah or, nah I prefer xyz. But oftentimes the question comes from a place of self-loathing, of feelings of inadequacy, and really the person just wants to believe that they are not a piece of shit. You can often tell by the way it's said. Coming to understand the difference between those two situations and learning how to respond is part of maturing your social intellect.

[Revan Noctis]

I do my best to avoid lying personally but a white lie here and there every now and then can be fine especially since the situation is forgotten about soon after.

In my experience mothers are more likely to use white lies, perhaps you should send your grandparents eggs to make up for it.

If you wish to only tell the truth then that is your decision, there have been many times I have preferred the truth over a lie, but keep in mind I think it can get a lot more complicate doing depending on how social you are.

[Schwi Dola]

I'm brutally honest and have a hard time holding it back. Its a problem. Especially when I'm not right.

[Amber Veritz]

If you're a close friend of mine, I will nail the truth into you with a sledgehammer. I ain't about that 'lying to make someone feel good' thing, but instead I'm honest and attempt to help them become better.

[Cell]

I'm pretty honest most of the time; depending on the lie, it will eat at me over time, so I'm usually straight. However I'm not above a white lie, especially if it means I stand to gain from it in some way (small stuff like saying I went for a run so I don't get roused on for not doing it, stuff that won't bite me in the arse and doesn't affect anyone).

[Ebonywood Hellscythe]

I'm not going to lie to make someone feel better, but there's a difference between saying something like each of the following:
"Your cooking sucks."
"This tastes disgusting."
"It's too salty."
"It could do with less time on the hob."

(Although some people can't take criticism no matter how it's phrased.)

And then for starting potential arguments and the like, I've usually found it's usually better to say something like, "I read somewhere that..." Or "I always thought..." Etc. (As long as you don't say you learnt it in school as a kid, because then you're blatantly insinuating they're stupid - and even if true, it's bad etiquette).

As opposed to starting out by saying someone is wrong or they're mistaken, or that you're right, etc. (With the exception of when they claimed something about you, or what you've done, so in those cases you're the authority on the matter, so saying someone is wrong or mistaken is totally cool.)

The latter will be taken as a person attack by some people and will usual make you look like a dick. And, should you actually be wrong or mistaken, you will look like an idiot. While with the former, you can often make someone realise they're wrong by themselves, unless the matter is highly subjective when you probably shouldn't have started arguing over it.

Obviously though, like with the eggs, there's not really a nice way to phrase it without lying. I probably would have said the same as you Jade, since I wasn't the one the throw them out so I wouldn't be in the wrong. But that might also be because I genuinely like finding fault in my mother, since she's always so insistent in always being right, or in the right. Probably a bad attitude for me to have, but it's not as prevalent as I made it sound.

But, I'll still lie. Particularly if it'll deal with a situation I don't care about a lot quicker, or if I stand something to gain, but that's if I'm pretty sure it won't come back to me later.

I'm always careful about the last part, since I told one lie when I was like 10-12ish and got caught out for it (probably told my parents I'd done my homework when I hadn't or something). Wasn't even anything big, but I got accused of something else shortly after, and since I was the resident liar it was obviously me. So, from there, I was basically the scapegoat for minor things. Never really cared because I wasn't ever punished, just blamed. But it was kind of annoying. Made me feel like a proper detective when I proved my innocence one time though, but if chocolate at home went missing it was still always my fault apparently.

Because of that, my parents think I'm a bad liar, when I'm really not. Which basically means I could lie to them whenever I want and they probably would never know. Not that I do, unless I stand something to gain, or it'll stop them worrying about me.

That said, lying is kinda fun. In a strange way. Like, seeing how long it'll be before someone catches you out. Hence why I like bluff based games such as Werewolves and Mafia. But, I ain't gonna lie about something important, even if it's to cover something dumb I did. I tend to take my crappy choices with me. None of that, "I accidentally left my homework at home" stuff.

[Takanomiya Hijiri]

But, I'll still lie. Particularly [...] if I stand something to gain

I like the way you think. :icon_twisted:

I told one lie when I was like 10-12ish and got caught out for it (probably told my parents I'd done my homework when I hadn't or something). Wasn't even anything big, but I got accused of something else shortly after, and since I was the resident liar it was obviously me.

Ah, that brings back memories. When I was younger my sisters and I would never own up to anything when we were in the wrong, so our parents usually just ended up punishing us all.