Diversity

[Thaal Sinestro]

Seriously, the topic of Diversity is a serious one, and should be strongly considered a lot by those of us who write.

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[Tearen Wover]

I try to incorporate a variety of race and body types into what I write, but then again, I don't often go out of my way to try and make sure black people are described as black, unless they're a main character and I'm doing a profile. (Racial Profiling lol).

But in all seriousness, I do feel like the general assumption about a character's appearance, if it's not specified explicitly, is that they are caucasian of some kind. This is not generally the image I have in my head, but on top of that, the number of white ambigu-casian characters in contrast to racial/ethnic characters tends to be tipped towards the pale.

Reviewing the Roster in the Omniverse, there is not a single humanblack prime (except maybe Black Mage annd maaaaaybe Ganondorf?). The largest minority group represented, if we're assuming all the anime characters are japanese, is represented by asians. However, should people start making black, human primes just to even the status quo? Maybe it would be a nice sentiment, but I don't think self-imposed affirmative summoning would wash away things as they are now.

One of my secondaries is black, and Nealaphh USED to be a black human (but I'm not gonna count that.) Maybe we can't equalize the prime roster, but I do think writers can start to make an effort to mention additional races in their posts.

[Okor]

I find the dead demographic is very much underrepresented.

[Tearen Wover]

I wonder though, is the abundance of non racially diverse characters a result of writer bias, or the bias of the media that they are taken from?

[Tartaros]

I wonder though, is the abundance of non racially diverse characters a result of writer bias, or the bias of the media that they are taken from?

Even though I disagree with a decent bit of what I've seen in the article (I mean, "Queer Identities After The Apocalypse: Trans Health Care and Queer Reproductive Choices In Post-Apocalyptic Worlds", seriously, what kind of post-apocalypse is this?), I'd almost certainly say the latter. Then again, I suppose it's a greater capitalistic or cultural thing though, not a conscious effort.

[Thaal Sinestro]

I wonder though, is the abundance of non racially diverse characters a result of writer bias, or the bias of the media that they are taken from?

Even though I disagree with a decent bit of what I've seen in the article (I mean, "Queer Identities After The Apocalypse: Trans Health Care and Queer Reproductive Choices In Post-Apocalyptic Worlds", seriously, what kind of post-apocalypse is this?), I'd almost certainly say the latter. Then again, I suppose it's a greater capitalistic or cultural thing though, not a conscious effort.

Those kinda choices and problems are realistic problems that people would be facing without a stable healthcare infrastructure. Those would be interesting panels to attend because they ask questions that aren't usually addressed by most post-apoc fiction, as evidenced by your totally dismissive and kinda insulting statement.

And I would tend to say both to the first question. Like, obviously it's easier to pull white/male characters out of fiction because they are, BY FAR, the most predominant characters of interest within them. Also though, we have a serious lack of OC characters that are people of color, disability or any other minority, and those characters we can't blame the media for. I would also say that there are a few good shining examples of interesting characters that are part of a minority that aren't chosen, like Michonne, Spawn, Oracle etc etc etc.

[Tartaros]

I wonder though, is the abundance of non racially diverse characters a result of writer bias, or the bias of the media that they are taken from?

Even though I disagree with a decent bit of what I've seen in the article (I mean, "Queer Identities After The Apocalypse: Trans Health Care and Queer Reproductive Choices In Post-Apocalyptic Worlds", seriously, what kind of post-apocalypse is this?), I'd almost certainly say the latter. Then again, I suppose it's a greater capitalistic or cultural thing though, not a conscious effort.

Those kinda choices and problems are realistic problems that people would be facing without a stable healthcare infrastructure. Those would be interesting panels to attend because they ask questions that aren't usually addressed by most post-apoc fiction, as evidenced by your totally dismissive and kinda insulting statement.

However, it only really affects a very small minority of the population (between two surveys by the Williams Institute of the Los Angeles School of Law in Massachusetts and California, a rough average of 0.3% of the survey's sample claimed to identify as transgender). While it would undoubtedly be an issue for some, and could make for interesting discussion, it isn't really a complex enough issue for a whole panel to be held regarding it ), and it would be better suited as an aspect of a panel of general health during such a situation (in my opinion, of course. And apologies if I came across as somewhat rude there, I tend to get somewhat bitter late at night)

And I would tend to say both to the first question. Like, obviously it's easier to pull white/male characters out of fiction because they are, BY FAR, the most predominant characters of interest within them. Also though, we have a serious lack of OC characters that are people of color, disability or any other minority, and those characters we can't blame the media for. I would also say that there are a few good shining examples of interesting characters that are part of a minority that aren't chosen, like Michonne, Spawn, Oracle etc etc etc.

I can't really deny this, however, I can bring up a point. Writing a character with a serious disability or mental illness can be a very challenging thing, and the illness can easily "drown out" the other aspects of the character to the reader if the writer is not careful, which just makes the character feel token and flat (I often see this with people attempting to portray illnesses, particular those such as Post Traumatic Stress Disorder in tabletop RPGs, though this is just an anecdote). So I believe the absence can also, in some cases, come from fear of coming off as insensitive to those suffering from said disability, and lack of confidence on the writer's part.

[Dave Strider]

I mean, just throwing this out there(maybe some guests will see) but a cool character would be static shock.

[Shulk]

I care more about writing/reading good stories than reading things that fill a diversity quota. You can't force diversity, authors have to be comfortable writing a diverse cast. A shitty story doesn't magically become better because it's diverse, and badly written "diverse" characters are way, way worse than a cast of all white, straight characters (although even then that isn't even a bad thing to begin with.)

Criticizing something because it's not diverse doesn't help things either. Writing's an art, and writers should be able to choose not to write something they don't understand without having their work criticized. It's superficial, and it lets bad writers get away with things others wouldn't because they filled that magical diversity quota. I agree that we need diversity, but the way it's getting pushed rubs me the wrong way.

That's all I have to say about that.

[Tartaros]

I care more about writing/reading good stories than reading things that fill a diversity quota. You can't force diversity, authors have to be comfortable writing a diverse cast. A shitty story doesn't magically become better because it's diverse, and badly written "diverse" characters are way, way worse than a cast of all white, straight characters (although even then that isn't even a bad thing to begin with.)

Criticizing something because it's not diverse doesn't help things either. Writing's an art, and writers should be able to choose not to write something they don't understand without having their work criticized. It's superficial, and it lets bad writers get away with things others wouldn't because they filled that magical diversity quota. I agree that we need diversity, but the way it's getting pushed rubs me the wrong way.

That's all I have to say about that.

I think you just managed to summarize my point of view on this Shulk. Thank you. :-)

[Tearen Wover]

I agree that people should not include diversity for diversity's sake, but I do not agree that avoiding diverdity die to insecurity on properly representing the groups in question is a valid reason to make a given cast of characters the same race as you are.

I am a white male and with Millie I write as a black female. Society dictates that we're polar opposites, but that's because society, by definition, can only look at the big picture. Apart from our external differences, Millie and I share a lot of the same mentality. I'm not concerned with making Millie 'act black' because that, in and of itself, would be stereotyping, no matter how innocuous. I made her black because that was the image I had in my head; the only thing I'm concerned about now is making her a good character. Human. Organic.

[Thaal Sinestro]

I care more about writing/reading good stories than reading things that fill a diversity quota. You can't force diversity, authors have to be comfortable writing a diverse cast. A shitty story doesn't magically become better because it's diverse, and badly written "diverse" characters are way, way worse than a cast of all white, straight characters (although even then that isn't even a bad thing to begin with.)

Criticizing something because it's not diverse doesn't help things either. Writing's an art, and writers should be able to choose not to write something they don't understand without having their work criticized. It's superficial, and it lets bad writers get away with things others wouldn't because they filled that magical diversity quota. I agree that we need diversity, but the way it's getting pushed rubs me the wrong way.

That's all I have to say about that.

Right, but filling a "diversity quota" isn't really what I'm talking about. Also, of COURSE, integrating diversity isn't what makes writing good or bad, but being mindful and thinking about who you are representing and how you are representing them in a story is still probably a good idea. Like, we're writing in a fantasy world (for the most part) where being a minority probably isn't looked at in the same way as it is here. Taking a look at a character from another point of view, or even randomly assigning race and gender to a character might not even effect how the character acts, just give them a slightly different description.

And a big part of being critical about works that don't have a diverse cast is trying to simply point out that there are massively unrepresented people in fiction, like the way that fantasy rarely integrates strong female characters, which is thankfully changing due to people pointing it out lots and lots. How many black superheroes are there? Way less than there are white ones, and almost nothing would really have to change about their characters other than what color code is assigned to their skin.

Just think about YOUR cast. Do their races or genders matter at all in the context of the fiction you are writing? Are any of their races or genders pivotal to the story? Would being a different race or gender change them at all as characters? If not, then why not include a more diverse cast?

[Thaal Sinestro]

However, it only really affects a very minority of the population.

Like, right. Exactly. That's exactly the point. Like, we hold discussion panels (literally) about, "College Prep with Buffy, Veronica, and the Fresh Prince," so it seems a bit ridiculous to say that the topic of a diversity panel is too specific. I also feel like people that attend diversity panels are the people that already care about diversity in writing, and so "Gender Identity In Fiction," is just a bit repetitive for people that already understand the basic concepts of how to approach the issue.

[Reece]

Just think about YOUR cast. Do their races or genders matter at all in the context of the fiction you are writing? Are any of their races or genders pivotal to the story? Would being a different race or gender change them at all as characters? If not, then why not include a more diverse cast?

This probably makes me come across as incredibly ignorant, but to be perfectly honest, the main reason I don't tend to include more diverse casts in things I write is just because it never even crosses my mind to do so.
Where I live, a vast majority of the population is white, so I just tend to assume that unimportant background characters are white.
I do sometimes write Japanese characters, because I'm an otaku, but that's about the extent of racial diversity from me.

Which is odd, now that I think about it, given that I pride myself on my open-mindedness...

I guess it's most likely just because both manga and western fantasy/sci-fi novels tend not to feature as many black characters, and that's pretty much all I read, so I've just gotten used to having stories written that way.

[Thaal Sinestro]

Just think about YOUR cast. Do their races or genders matter at all in the context of the fiction you are writing? Are any of their races or genders pivotal to the story? Would being a different race or gender change them at all as characters? If not, then why not include a more diverse cast?

This probably makes me come across as incredibly ignorant, but to be perfectly honest, the main reason I don't tend to include more diverse casts in things I write is just because it never even crosses my mind to do so.
Where I live, a vast majority of the population is white, so I just tend to assume that unimportant background characters are white.
I do sometimes write Japanese characters, because I'm an otaku, but that's about the extent of racial diversity from me.

Which is odd, now that I think about it, given that I pride myself on my open-mindedness...

I guess it's most likely just because both manga and western fantasy/sci-fi novels tend not to feature as many black characters, and that's pretty much all I read, so I've just gotten used to having stories written that way.

And that's ok, you didn't do that on purpose, but now that you've noticed it, especially in a world where literally everyone is from EVERY CONCEIVABLE REALITY, it would be a cool thing to mix in people of different races, genders, gender IDs, and even crazier shit like ALIEN RACES or like, GHOSTS or things. This is a zany world we're living in haha