Why the Omniverse Has Rules

[Aaron]

Now before I come across as any more pompous than usual, let me clarify that this thread is intended to be a discussion, not a lecture. I do intend to express my own (somewhat lengthy) opinion here, though, in the understanding that I have no actual authority or control over the actual efficacy of what's discussed.

Now then, it seems to me like there's been a surplus of debate recently about why the Omniverse has numbers, powers, Omnilium and the rest of it if so much of actual combat comes down to writing skill and non-literal factors. The mentality that numbers and moves need to represent hard, steadfast datapoints for usage in combat is commonly referred to here as "gameyness". I feel like a lot of disgruntlement in our more gamey writers stems from an inherent misunderstanding about why combat and Prime building has structure in the first place.

Let me start with a relevant anecdote: my primary roleplaying site before the Omniverse was a completely open-ended RP that had almost no hard rules about who you could be or what you could do. Obviously, this format is a double-edged sword, because while it DID allow for interesting and epic IC moments, it was more often the case that reasonable, self-resricting writers would be easily overruled by pushy, power-hungry authors who refused to let their characters die. Even losing was considered regretful in these more enterprising writers, so the entire OOC chat was often awash with salt and finger-pointing about who was being more egregiously overpowered. The irony, of course, was that it was impossible to be overpowered, because there were effectively no limits.

Cut to the Omniverse. Coming from my previous setting, I was glad to see a system like the one our Staff has set up, because my previous experience helped me understand what it was really meant to do. The leveling up, the purchasing of moves, the power caps, and the stats; none of it is here to give our Primes power. It's written the way it is to control and balance that power.

Now, from a purely literary perspective, the word 'control' can be construed as somewhat dirty, but I assure you that it is vital to maintaining the single most important part of the Omniverse: Consistent Narrative. The only way to maintain a living, breathing open-world format like Greg and Alex have constructed is to have a system that denotes what Primes are able to affect in relation to the world around them, and by dint of association, to one-another. Too much freedom would lead to wanton chaos and a lack of cohesive stories. Too many systems and numbers would make it hard to write actual stories. The key, as ever, is balance.

The point of the the game rules are not to define what each and every Prime is capable of. It's to prevent fights from devolving into games of 'he said, she said'. Instead of having, say, a younger writer assume he can outrun Cirno because his Prime is a catperson, he can instead look at Cirno's overcranked SPD stat and determine that his 3 is not going to outperform her 5.

They're both still fast, that much is certain, but there is clearly demarcated proof thaf Cirno is faster. This maintains structure, which allows for better writing. Likewise, Cirno's lackluster defense may be no match for catboy's attack, so if he does get his claws on her, it's going to hurt. Now the point of the fight becomes "how do I get my hands on the damn fairy?" Just because Cirno is fast, doesn't mean she ALWAYS outruns slower Primes. Maybe they have a trick, maybe she makes a mistake, maybe she gets cocky. Now the fight is dynamic, instead of two people at keyboards spamming hotkeys and rapid-clicking.

This is where moves start to come into play, because they should (ideally) be able to create opportunities to circumvent these harder numbers. This is where the maintained framework can have its boundaries pushed, to an extent, as long as it's conducive to a solid narrative and a better story. Trying to introduce moves that rely too much on intricate qualifiers or usage dynamics actually suffocates the literary quality of a given scene, and essentially forces other writers to conform to rules they did not agree to when they signed up. In summary the best way to push out from our constraints is not to create new rules, but expand in the directions that the rules do not cover.

I'm not talking about loopholes, either. I'm talking about choices the writers can make that are not explicitly controlled by our rules. Things like environment, motivation, bystanders, existing injuries, IC history etc. These can also create opportunities where numbers would otherwise seem to indicate impossibilities (not that they ever categorically do so in this format).

I could go more into specific instances, such as why certain powers are priced the way they are, or why numbers DO matter in some instances, but I think I've made my point. At the end of the day, the rules exist so it's easier for writers and staff to look at a situation and say "Yeah, that makes sense" or "That doesn't seem right" while still allowing enough contextual freedom to allow for enjoyable creativity.



Discuss.

[Hiro Protagonist]

I mean...I think the only actual pvp fight I've won with Hiro was the 2v1 vs Kerrigan with Strazio helping me. His record is 1/2. But every fight I've had him in has been a auper epic clash, and a great way to explore his motivations and how they've shaped his philosophy in the Pmniverse.

[Aaron]

Well that's the point; you don't need to 'win' to feel like you've accomplished something. A good story has its ups and downs, and the Omniverse is simply designed to ensure that good stories are told.

[Illidan Stormrage]

I agree. I enjoy stats within a site like this where they are only used as a guide. I like that I can write Illidan as fast and powerful but weak to hits and yet that has no overall effect on how the fight will be graded. It creates another ability to characterise without worrying about min/maxing like other RPGs do. I think everything else is well balanced and written so that fights actually matter and you can't have people turtling or wiping out a 'weaker' opponent with one attack.

My only bugbear with the system is the amount of detail I have to put in when creating a move. I understand why this is required but I put off making moves as long as possible because I have to think of about eleven different things every time and I always forget about three and it feels like I'm writing an essay.

I've been in the Move Creation Workshop thread to iron out some moves for Koola and Ebonywood, who's been a big help, has pointed out I still technically need to include a few more aspects around my moves. I suppose my issue is that a reasonable person would see what I'm going for (if you followed DBZ I guess) but I still have to go through the effort of prescribing exactly how every part of the move works. BUT not everyone has watched DBZ or they might remember it differently or if it's not specified then it could technically be open for abuse (not that I would, but it could be).

As I said, I understand the why. I just don't like it. /whinge

[Jade Harley]

I like the system here. I adore the way moves, powers, and stats are set up. I think they're pretty simple rules to follow, too, so long as you go for something that doesn't have too many variables and follow the move examples. I mean, heck, I've only purchased like two gun moves for Jade and a few other painfully simple moves. It's a method that has worked out for Ada, too. This hasn't "hurt" my character at all, it's easy to get a lot of good writing and roleplay stuff out of just one or two moves.

From a staff standpoint, I think a lot of people spend most of their time trying to rebuild their character's canon skillset instead of writing. It's usually the same people who submit moves for approval every other week, and this causes frustration for them because they maybe(????) feel like their writing hinges upon having those moves. But, to be honest, I don't think having a bucket load of moves is necessary, because you only get to use a few of them in a fight, if ever. Transformations and powers are more interesting to me, personally!

[Trixie]

I guess the only thing I have to add is that I didn't really worry about my stats outside of when I joined and when I bought my two upgrades. I'm a huge proponent of starting with a base character design and then, by writing, developing said character like an actual person through experiences. The Trixie that entered the Omniverse is a much different Trixie than the one that exists now having been through the Underverse and Imperial pressure to perform. When I plan stories for my characters I plan how to progress them as people.

[Omni]

I agree. I enjoy stats within a site like this where they are only used as a guide. I like that I can write Illidan as fast and powerful but weak to hits and yet that has no overall effect on how the fight will be graded. It creates another ability to characterise without worrying about min/maxing like other RPGs do. I think everything else is well balanced and written so that fights actually matter and you can't have people turtling or wiping out a 'weaker' opponent with one attack.

My only bugbear with the system is the amount of detail I have to put in when creating a move. I understand why this is required but I put off making moves as long as possible because I have to think of about eleven different things every time and I always forget about three and it feels like I'm writing an essay.

I've been in the Move Creation Workshop thread to iron out some moves for Koola and Ebonywood, who's been a big help, has pointed out I still technically need to include a few more aspects around my moves. I suppose my issue is that a reasonable person would see what I'm going for (if you followed DBZ I guess) but I still have to go through the effort of prescribing exactly how every part of the move works. BUT not everyone has watched DBZ or they might remember it differently or if it's not specified then it could technically be open for abuse (not that I would, but it could be).

As I said, I understand the why. I just don't like it. /whinge

This is something I'm painfully aware of, and I actively try to improve. I actually thought of writing move 'templates' but I think it would maks the move descriptions way longer than they need to be by listing every as a separate sentence like. "Enel fires a ball. It is around the size of a basketball. It flies about as fast as a bullet. It takes five seconds to charge up." That's already kind of a problem. Whereas I try to write mine out as"Enel takes five seconds to charge up a basketball-sized attack, which flies about as fast as a bullet." for brevity. It pains me when we ask people to add extra detail to a move like "how long does it take?" and it just gets slapped onto the end as a separate sentence like that, which is why I often end up just rewriting the move for them. I'm not so anal that I'm gonna ask everyone "please write it out more succinctly" when the approval process is already so arduous so often, but it does pain me to see these three-paragraph moves about a fireball or something.

As it stands, I think the checklist we use is probably the best way to do things. For 90% of moves, the extra detail we ask for is already listed on there somewhere (half the time the missing detail, and the most important IMO, is "how fast is this attack?"). For more complex moves, it's difficult to make a set checklist without listing every possible move.

Sometimes staffers ask for details I wouldn't see as necessary, like the range on a ranged attack (unless stated otherwise, I assume it flies basically until it hits something, like a bullet). A solution I was thinking about would be to basically write a set of assumptions for different attack types. Like, "unless stated otherwise, ranged attacks fly at around the speed of a thrown object." and the like.