Balance

[Schwi Dola]

So I've wondered a lot and I know others wonder about this.

Where is the balance between super moves and transformation?

From what I'm told a Tech 0 person will hit a speed 20 person  at equal chance it would  hit a speed 0 person. A person with 20 defense would take equal damage as a person with 0 defense. Meanwhile  you get maybe 2 attacks in per round in your transform per round while super moves auto  hit you for massive damage.

I'd there something  I'm not getting?

A simple  solution  would  be that a super move would be all stats set to 5 plus (5 times  tier) far from perfect  but  it gives room  to be a little  more realistic.

[Harry Dresden]

A super move at tier one is a single attack that eats 2 SP. At level 2, that's it. You used all your SP for that entire topic. If there's another fight after the one you're in, you're OUT of SP. A transformation at tier 1 takes 1 SP per post. If you boost your attack from 5 to 7, that's almost steel-shattering strikes for that post.

Also, a tech 0 person is going to have a very hard time hitting a tree, much less a person moving at 20 Speed. If someone had 20 DEF they'd be no-selling anything short of a Super Move; half that can tank intercontinental ballistic missiles without really caring that much. The reason Super Moves autohit unless a defensive super move is used; you're spending the same amount of SP as a 2-round transformation for a single attack. It'd be annoying beyond belief for someone to dodge that because they have a higher SPD than yours or put all their OM into stat increases to DEF and TEC.

[Dark Link]

I'm not sure if you remember, Desco, but we actually talked about this in the chat not too long ago. Though, obviously, it is still a good thing you brought it up here, since the mods have the actual authority to reply to your inquiry.

The important thing to remember is that a fight doesn't just consist of combatants exchanging Super Moves; after all, they wouldn't be very "Super" if that's all the fighters ever used. There is a lot of sparring and light attacks between Super Moves and it is those that transformations influence. Ultimately, even if you manage to successfully fire off all your Super Moves, it doesn't do you any good if your opponent was able to deal massive amounts of damage to you between those moves.

[Schwi Dola]

What do you mean If? Super moves cannot be dodged. There is no 'if' in landing the move unless you choose to fail.

And in a default battle Two players have no control over eachother. So there is little sparring, and you can't expect to reasonably attack without recovering from a super blast that has nearly killed you only for another to come the next post.

Looking at how much damage just normal moves deal I think it would be safe to say that 2 tier one super moves is autokill. You can't stop it unless you have super blocks or take chance with opposed offense. But one person could spend so on transforming only to instantly die to a tier 2 move.

[Dark Link]

Even if you can't dodge it, that doesn't mean you can't fire one off yourself and thus turn the chance of the enemy's attack hitting you into a random one. And considering the amount of posts two combatants are limited to (usually three, although that depends on what the combatants agreed to), there isn't really a whole lot of opportunity to use Super Moves.

As for your second comment....to be honest, I'm glad you brought that up, because I would argue that the real heart of this matter is not "balance" but the definition of "godmodding". If I remember right (and please correct me if I'm not), you seem to believe that writing any of your opponent's actions at all qualifies as godmodding. Under that assumption, I can see how you might have come to the conclusion that the current system is imbalanced in favour of cheap Super Moves, since if all you can do is write your own moves, there is no reason not to keep firing Super Moves.

But while I'm no moderator, even I can safely say that that was not the definition of godmodding under which the current combat system was designed. After all, you read the example Omni wrote for the Fighting and Competition Rules. To some degree, Samus' "posts" involve Alundra's actions and Alundra's "posts" involve Samus' actions. Their actions don't exist in a void away from one another, but are tied together. So even if you don't have technical control over your opponent's actions (for example, you can't fire off a Super Move in their stead), you do (again, to some degree) have a narrative one. In that situation, there is plenty of room for sparring and minor attacks.

Only Omni/the moderators can provide the working definition of godmodding under which the Omniverse operates. But in my own past experience, the working definition of godmodding was "making other characters behave wildly out-of-character, particularly for the purpose of making your own character(s) appear superior". As long as you did not abuse it for the purpose of narratively tilting the fight in your favour, you were able to depict some of your opponent's actions in your own posts. But of course, those were different RPGs and I cannot claim with 100% certainty that definition applies to the Omniverse.

[Schwi Dola]

It's not just that. If you have 4 more sp than your opponent you can simply spam super moves until they die.

I a mechanically reasonable situation like that.

1: Transform tier 3.

2: super move tier 1

1:normal attack

2: super move tier 1.

1: dead.

[Ganondorf]

You're assuming Tier 1 Super Moves are more powerful than they are. If I were to judge that fight, I would assign, at most, 3 damage per Super Move. Meaning you'd still have 14 damage left before death.

From my own point of view, Super Moves and Transformations are equally useful and powerful. While Transformations (and stats), are mainly there for roleplay purposes, a judge could and should take into account that someone used one during the judging process.

Basically, Super Moves provide immediate results, whereas Transformations provide long term benefits.

You have to remember that this site is extremely free form in execution. Aside from buying things with OM, and how Super Moves work, almost everything else is left up to your imagination and interpretation.

A good example of how useful a Powered-Up Form can be is my fight against the Rathian during the Rathalos event. When I transformed, I was able to better match the beast in regards to stats. Before then, it was obviously more than a match for any one of the combatants.

So, in order to spam Super Moves to win you'd need to both have, if I were to judge, at least 14 SP and be fighting an opponent with absolutely no Defensive Super Moves. Granted, using Super Moves in succession will weaken your foe and give you a better chance to win, but it's by no means guaranteed.

In fact, even damage is relatively moot in regards to most fights. You completely heal damage between fights, unless they occur in relatively quick iterations.

TL;DR: Both Super Moves and Transformations are primarily in place to HELP you roleplay. Same for everything else on the site. How you use them is up to you.

[Schwi Dola]

Then this does a 180, reading through damage rules. 0 defense for example, vs breaks concrete at att 4. Reasonably, a normal hit from that difference should kill the person with 0 defense shouldn't it?

Why is a fatality awarded when nobody has lost even half their life?

[Ganondorf]

Reasonably, people don't have floating octopi pets, the force doesn't exist, etc. Try to suspend your reliance on the rules of reality for a moment. The examples listed in the stats are there to show relative difference and aren't meant to be taken literally.

And i assume you're talking about the thing for after a fight when you say someone can die without losing half their hp. You're free to roleplay how you wish the end of a fight to go, but the basic thing is that if you have that choice, its due to you beating your foe into helplessness.

[Schwi Dola]

Well, I kinda was taking them more or less literally .

[Ganondorf]

The examples are mostly there so a guy with, say, 5 ATK doesn't say he can go around blowing up cities with ease. Obviously, if you're fighting someone with 5 ATK and you have 0 Def you SHOULD be writing his attacks as hurting a lot, but it wouldn't need to be like getting hit by a train.