Avatar with ... altered elements? - Printable Version +- Omni Archive (https://omni.zulenka.com) +-- Forum: Discussion Forums (https://omni.zulenka.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=3) +--- Forum: Omniverse Discussion (https://omni.zulenka.com/forumdisplay.php?fid=22) +--- Thread: Avatar with ... altered elements? (/showthread.php?tid=6277)

Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-11-2017 So I've recently discovered an interesting game called Magicka. The magic system in it is... well... it's nothing short of epic. There are eight "elements" which the user can wield. These are: Fire, Water, Ice, Lightning, Arcane, Life, Shield, Earth. The big question is how would I incorperate this, or... should I even try? There are a lot of things that WON'T work from the game, namely the Shield. I've only played a little (for the moment) but Shield + Any element equals an immunity form that element - which is a biiiiiiig nono in Omniverse. Not to mention it would be a major pain in the butt to pay for every little variation. I'm not a mathmatician (maybe a little) but even with the "X and Y never mix) there are still over a hundred unique variations of spells, assuming adding three x's only modify power, and not effect. Another problem is continuity. Aang is a "bender" so channeling these elements in such a different way to preform the same thing is odd. He could already do most of the stuff in the game without breaking it down to eight elements. Only exception is Arcane. I'm asking because I'm looking to have Aang complete the Dalaran faction quest and obtain a Mage instructor to teach him perhaps some form of magic. If you don't think this would fit in, then I'm open to alternatives. It's not that I don't like the idea of how MAgicka works (it's epic) I just don't think it would help Aang too much if he could do it far more fluidly. Big topic, I'd love ideas wherever you can offer them. If you think there is a better faction for Aang (that I've obviously missed) then point me in the right direction. He may not even need to join Dalaran! But I like the idea of him becoming something of a well known steeple of "good" in some way. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - The Vision - 06-11-2017 For your consideration: [spoiler][/spoiler] RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Amaterasu - 06-11-2017 A Magicka wizard would be brutally expensive to make work. If I remember correctly they can combine up to 5 elements at a time in Magicka (and 3 in the PvP game), even 5x/3x the same one, and they can cast three different types of spells with that combination (Self, AoE, Projectile) plus the "Spacebar" spells like Haste and Teleport? Here's how many possible combinations that would give, neglecting the things like how Life and Arcane don't combine: 8x8x8x8x8 (or 8^5) x 3 = 98.304 or 8x8x8 x 3 = 1.536. Obviously in Magicka many combinations are very similar, but yep - there's a huge load of potential combinations, from dropping a rock on yourself to a lightning fire arcane laserbeam. All those combinations would take you almost 3 million OM to purchase. HOWEVER! You could purchase a handful of moves with fixed effects, and add all sorts of fluff that does not change its effects. For example, you could purchase an "Arcane Beam" attack, and add that Aang can also infuse the beam with lightning, fire, ice or something, which changes its appearance but does not add effects - or, for fluff, Aang could be using Life instead of Arcane against undead opponents to damage them. This would also allow you to summon AoE shields, but not long-lasting personal shields that boost your DEF stat, without buying a Power-Up. Here's a collection of ideas that I would have: (Offensive) -Projectile (regular, charged), Beam -AoE around the player or at a distance, or an exploding projectile -Mines -Hail mini-projectiles (you get those in the game by combining ice and earth) -Infusing your weapon with an element to deliver an empowered attack or throw a crescent projectile -Offensive spells like Meteor Storm (Defensive) -Personal Shields (these would have to be a Power-Up if they're more than just briefly covering your character from a single attack) -AoE shield/wall in front of (half circle) or around yourself (dome/bubble shield) -Perhaps a combination of elements that removes debuffs when self-casted? (I'm not sure if this is permissible) -Defensive Spells like (Utility) -Grease to make the ground slippery -Rain (Power-Up) -Long-lasting personal shields (Boulder + Shield for instance) -Summon Death, Raise Dead, Summon Elemental (Assists) -Haste (+SPD, +ATK?) RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - 2B - 06-11-2017 Well, Aang has practically everything else covered, except Arcane. The series already has advanced bends that become things like lightning, ice, blood, yadda yadda. What he doesn't have, is arcane. What are magical arts? Arcane arts. What didn't Aang have again? Arcane. So why not have him learn arcane, as an addition to what he already knows. The thing about Arcane is, that it's the "neutral" element. It's considered to be highly malleable, incredibly potent, but at the same time incredibly explosive in the hands of those, whom cannot control it. As such, a risk of blowing yourself to smithereens exists, without the proper control. So, in essence, he'd learn to bend something that is no element at all. It's everywhere, as Arcane power is drawn from within. Arcane is the very essence of magic, the very corner stone every other magic is built upon. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - The Vision - 06-11-2017 Ooh I do like the "arcane" approach, though I interpreted more as a bending of physical forces, as in stuff like gravity or force fields. This reminds me a bit of the five Greek elements, which is Air, Fire, Water, Earth, and Aether, which is supposed to be this generic gas-like substance that fills space. Also I think sometimes spirits/souls/minds are made of this? Pretty sure this is supposed to be like the neutral element that 2B speaks of. I think I have something new to bring to the table - I'm Asian. I was born in Korea and I'm currently in the damn place. The four elements are sorta... well, they're not what I learned. First of all, there are five. I learned Fire, Water, Wood, Metal/Steel/Gold, Earth. Obviously they did away with Wood and Gold and added Wind, because Metalbending is just advanced Earthbending. I dunno if that's helpful, just throwing that out there. Speaking of Asian influences, if you do go with Lifebending, that might be the direction of a Warlock kinda thing. You know, giving something to take something. Which would tie in nicely with the ancient Chinese obsession with duality. (There's a reason why yin/yangs are everywhere) So I support Arcanebending and Lifebending. (Calling them bending because why not) RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Dane Regan - 06-11-2017 Actually, you could still do a shield immunity or resistance (depending on how strong the attack was, the move drawbacks, and if it's a super move) from an element without breaking the rules (I think) as follows: Get a shield move. Super defense or just a general balanced move that has no elements attatched. Then, as rp flavour, specify that the shield can change colours/appearance with respect to a chosen element or set of elements when cast. E.g. you shield spell looks like a wall of fire, or earth, etc. So, someone shoots a fireball at you, you block it with your fire shield (or an element that would resist fire). Someone shoots an ice spike at you, you do the same. Someone tries to hit you with a normal sword or arrow, you just make the shield look like a mix of elements or just a generic white/translucent wall. You don't get a resistance to specifc elements exactly, because mechanically your wall of plants would block a fireball just as well as a water wall (unless you decide to nerf it to hold up the rp). But by simply changing the cosmetics of a shield, you can make it look like you're blocking a specific element with it, an thus rp it like that. As long as you don't give each elemental shield specific properties like "the fire one burns people who touch it" and "the ice one slows people down" (by which you'd need to make it a variant move), you should be able to get away with it. My main point here is, if a fire spell and water spell are the same besides the cosmetic look, you can probably negociate it down to one move. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Jaixe Furiael - 06-11-2017 If I may offer my input, the Avatar already has most of those elements, just in his own unique style. Spirit bending (the ability to take away a person's bending ability) can easily be seen as life bending, and can be developed far more in the Omniverse. You already can bend metal, air, water, fire, lightning, and earth to boot, or at least learn how. Granted, Aang didn't learn lightning or metal bending in his time as the Avatar, Korra did, but he can learn how from the insight of that magic instructor if you wanted to go down that route of expanding his bending capabilities. The thing about the Avatar series special view of magic is that it's natural, and each of the elements is unique and has its own nature to it. Fire is energy, emotion, and light. Earth is surety, confidence, a bulwark amongst the rest. Air is flowing, ever-changing in its direction, and water is similar but different, it moves with the tide and has a balance between aggression and serenity. The Avatar series really hammered in these points, making it all feel alive and natural rather than straight up magical. Until Korra and the Equalists came around, we never questioned it all that much I'd imagine, and even then, Bending felt like it was part of the world, not an extra facet of reality. If you're going to add new elements, think of what they'd represent, what their nature would be, how that is altered by the Omniverse's rules, and then see what you can come up with. Or you can give him straight up magic, either option is valid depending on how well you want to stick to the continuity and theme of your character. Avatar's magic doesn't have to be the same as other universes' variation of it, and a person can use multiple styles in the Omniverse if they wanted. I really do recommend developing Spirit bending though, that could be really neat to explore in more depth than what the shows did. A good example of what you can do is expand on the removal of bending by getting a debuff ability that temporarily hampers a person's ability to use their own magic. Also, as for Shield and the Arcane, why not focus on energy in general as an additional element? The source of the rest perhaps, or something a little more cosmic that has a similarity to Spirit bending? RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-12-2017 All things above considered, I do feel like the Avatar already has a superior lead when it comes to fluidity of combat but lacks when it comes to variety. Magicka shows the ability to combine elements, such as fire and earth to create flaming throwing stones. Perhaps he could learn to combine bending abilities - ignite his Stone Gloves so that if they grip someone, they deal burn damage as well? I can't remember any actual combination of elements, except for that scene where thye were trying to induce the avatar state. Even then, it only made mud. Channeling lightning through an ice spear could be a much better tactic. Then there is Arcane. Maybe he could somehow learn to combine this with Spiritbending to create ... alchemy... Stone Golems that crush, Lightning Golems that rush, Water Golems that slosh and Air Golems - oh so posh! Then again, this might be managable through Spiritbending alone, if left to develope in the Omniverse. Which means the only thing Magicka really offers (that is outwardly obvious) is Arcane and the ability to loosely combine elements... The latter Aang could discover through experimentation or perhaps suggestion... Is there any reason to still go with Magicka? The game is great, but it doesn't bring much new to the table that Aang doesn't have in spades. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - The Vision - 06-12-2017 He already can make burning rocks and stuff, if his fight with Ozai shows us anything. Just in case... [spoiler]Right when we think (or are supposed to think) Aang is gonna kill Ozai, he makes like this weird spiral thing out of all four of the elements.[/spoiler] RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-12-2017 That was a very loose amalgamation of the elements. The combination I'm talking about is somehting like using Ice Shard (a move which I possess) and then use a Lightning move that has an added effect if the target is still carrying a shard. Combination was just not explored, and rightly so; since the Avatar was always taught the four elements as individual aspects. Until Aang, the nations that bore them were intentionally kept separate. That could be personal growth though... Spiritbending seems to be a big thing that begs for improvement. Creating mock life could be a potentially powerful ability (as story fodder and as an advancement to his arsenal.) Anyone have an idea what source would have a decent "spiritual" adviser? RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Omni - 06-14-2017 I feel like Avatar already has its own very comprehensive, complete system for elements, and smashing the two systems together is ... while possible, I have to wonder why, really. I mean, you do you. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-15-2017 Agreed. It was a suggestion brought to me, and at first it sounded amazing, but I started trying to plan the mechanics for it and found that they just... don't mesh real well. Spiritbending is what I'm wanting to focus on, if I cna find something pretty decent. Any suggestions on what sort of spiritist Aang might mesh well with? RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Sarah Kerrigan - 06-19-2017 Really, if you want to merge the elements together, it could just be seen as Aang pushing past what the avatars already could do by using elemental moves in tandem. Making that also follow Magicka's systems seems like you might be overcomplicating what you want, which - at it's core - seems to be combining and mixing the elements you have together to new effect. or at least that's how I see it. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Gaston - 06-19-2017 For Spirit Bending, perhaps a move that, with heavy drawbacks, temporarily creates a spirit copy of Aang, which moves outside the body and explores independently? Obviously, it'd need a time limit, and probably would leave the body defenceless, but could be useful. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-19-2017 I'm heavily considering Spirit-bending, or at least some spiritual aspect. I'm actually looking for a good source to look into as an instructor, if anyone has any options. I'm trying to steer clear of anything like "Bleach" that uses spirit power for pure attack and less... well... spiritual stuff... then again, the R&D of Bleach to make the artificial souls might be interesting. Things I'm looking for: I'd like the spiritual aspect to be able to link to the natural elements. Maybe less battle-prone, more utility and enlightenment like. Spiritual aspects cannot be considered "Evil" or "Dark." Avoid Christianity-based themes. Move ideas: Elemental Golems (So Faux Soul creation of sorts) Become Elemental (Being able to transmute one's physical body into an element, or bond more closely to an element druid style.) Meta-Elements (Altered elements in some way based on their "higher" properties: "Spirit of Fire") Buffs, perhaps? RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Dr. McNinja - 06-19-2017 Spiritbending in the first series was pretty much exclusively used to remove bending. (or to teach Spiritbending but that doesn't count) As such, maybe you can make a Super Debuff move where you take away certain abilities or some such thing. RE: Avatar with ... altered elements? - Alex Mercer - 06-21-2017 I think I've found a good nature-spirit-type teacher for Aang. Pathfinder's Druid with the Elemental Ally Archetype.